European microphone receives Valérie Toranian, the director of The Review of Two Worldsback from reporting in Armenia, after the attack of this country by Azerbaijan more than a month ago.
franceinfo: You were in Armenia, what did you see in this country today?
Valerie Toranian: Armenia, this country which has just been attacked in a completely illegal manner, according to the rules of international law, on 13 and 14 September by Azerbaijan, is living in anguish, in anguish, because that this attack, which was stopped fairly quickly, could result in other military offensives. Today, Azerbaijan attacked Armenia in its sovereign territory, and occupies 50 square kilometers, they are fortifying their positions. They fired on civilian homes. There is no strategic stake in this part of Armenia. It is the south of Armenia.
And today, the question that arises is an existential question. She is straightforward. Are the Armenians who have lived in these lands for centuries, who have already been massacred in the 1915 genocide – that was 100 years ago – are these Armenians, both from the territory of the Nagorno-Karabakh, do these Armenians of the very territory of Armenia still have the right to live on their land or not? Because the Turkish-Azerbaijani plan, when you look at a map, it is simple. That is to say that Armenia is a very small lock which is wedged between, to the east, Azerbaijan, to the west, Turkey. And there, to create this great Turkic space, this Pan-Turkism which would connect from the Bosphorus to Central Asia, all these Turkic-speaking peoples, well that is Erdogan’s great project.
So the question is that. I see people who are surviving, who have been bombed, who have taken refuge in caves, who are unarmed, who are abandoned from all over the world.
Who tell you: “Lhe world has forgotten us”…
“The world has forgotten us”the world is completely absorbed by the war in Ukraine which must obviously be condemned, and we understand, because it is a very serious event.
Except that Mrs Ursula von der Leyen, President of the European Commission, buys Azerbaijani gas…
That’s what’s tragic, I was for my report, including in small villages in the south, near the border area, where the military offensive took place. But there is not a small village in Armenia where we do not know the name of Ursula von der Leyen. And people tell you:But then what? Are you going to sacrifice us Armenians for gas? But that is not possible. Tell us no, tell us that President Macron is going to do something!”
/2022/10/22/phpmQr35R.jpg)
You said it, Azerbaijan, the targets are the civilians. It is not a strategic issue. But there, the Armenians are waiting for France, because France, does that mean something in Armenia?
But France means something in Armenia, I was going to say for centuries. But it’s true, it’s a country that has a civilizational and cultural proximity, which moreover hosted the Francophonie in 2018. It’s a country that is very close to us, and they expect from France, this country of human rights, which welcomed Armenian exiles after the genocide, this country which still proclaims itself to be at the forefront of the fights for the rights of peoples, etc… to do something for Armenia.
Today, President Macron has an important initiative, certainly, to send a mission of civilians to the border, to try to normalize this question of the borders between Armenia and Azerbaijan. But that’s not enough at all. What is needed are interposition forces. We need people there. UN blue helmets, which prevent Azerbaijan from launching a new offensive.
If we go back a few decades, this is what should have been done for the wars in Yugoslavia. An interposition force between the Slovenes and the Yugoslav federal army, for example ?
For instance. This is also what should be done in the case of Nagorno-Karabakh, I remind you, it is this historic Armenian region which is completely enclosed in Azerbaijan because Stalin gave it to Azerbaijan in 1921 They too today I tried to go to Nagorno-Karabakh. We were a delegation, we were a certain number of French people, no one comes through, the journalists no longer come through.
People are more and more isolated, isolated and terrified, because there are still some forces. There are still Russian soldiers, but finally, the Russian soldiers are less and less motivated with regard to the Armenian question. They tragically abandoned the Armenians, while there was a supposed military alliance that the moment Armenia is attacked, Russia is supposed to react. She did not do it.
So the noose is tightening, and France, if Emmanuel Macron could initiate a real resolution to protect the Armenian populations, it would be absolutely urgent today. And morally, it is an unspeakable mistake to abandon Armenia today.
Armenia and the Armenians need France…
Absolutely, more than ever…